Abusing game weakness to make lots of gold (cheating)

[gebba]

Hi,
I want to share something I figured out.
Probably most of you know that you get random loot from barrels, containers, lootbags etc.
quicksave before opening one, if you dont like the items then reload and open it again. repeat that until you are happy with the loot you obtained.
I know that this may ruin the fun of the game for some, but it is as annoying to find only trash in a chest that you worked hard to get near.
I had crap eq and was quite poor, after using this cheating I made lots of gold (worst part is I cant stop doing it on every new chest I find).
This is not a bug, but rather abusing the random loot generator of the game.
For Book II, I suggest making most of the loot fixed, not random.

[quasius]

Hi,
I want to share something I figured out.
Probably most of you know that you get random loot from barrels, containers, lootbags etc.
quicksave before opening one, if you dont like the items then reload and open it again. repeat that until you are happy with the loot you obtained.
I know that this may ruin the fun of the game for some, but it is as annoying to find only trash in a chest that you worked hard to get near.
I had crap eq and was quite poor, after using this cheating I made lots of gold (worst part is I cant stop doing it on every new chest I find).
This is not a bug, but rather abusing the random loot generator of the game.
For Book II, I suggest making most of the loot fixed, not random.

You're not the first person to figure this out. In fact, this has been the case in most CRPGs for about forever. Putting fixed loot takes dev time and doesn't necessarily accomplish a lot.
Anyone can abuse or not abuse this. If you enjoy save/reloading to get better loot, do it. If you think it ruins the game, don't do it. If you think it ruins the game but don't have enough self-control not to do it, you have self-discipline problems that go much deeper than this game.

[alpha]

Game is protected vs this, I think.

[realmzmaster]

The random item generator also helps with replayability. Some items in Eschalon are fixed such as Lilith's sword, the sealed notes, wedding ring and the Crux of Ages. Most of the items are randomly generated in chests and barrels making it like a box of Cracker Jacks you never know what the prize inside will be. If all or most of the items were fixed it would add to development time and once you know where to find the uber weapon you can run straight to the chest and grab it. Not knowing what is in the chest makes you want to go and fight the foe or foes to get a chance to open the chest. Yes you can keep re-loading and re-loading , but that gets tired real quick. Some randomness in a game adds to the excitement.

[Bartek]

Some randomness in a game adds to the excitement.

That's true, but too much randomness is not good either. IMHO the loot is too randomized in the game, the same stand-alone barrel could get nothing or a very valuable artifact. There should a lesser variance in the power of random items in a given location.

The other thing is the fact, that random item is generated in the moment of opening the container, and it really makes reloading very tempting. It might be solved the other way - all random items are pre-generated at the start of the game (or a the start of location). You will still find the random item in a chest, but any time you try you will find the same item when playing with particular character.

[Rune_74]

Thas a good idea bartek. could make starting a game a little longer but then its set.

[PaSquall]

Another simple way to fix it would be to add to the object a "rank", rating from 1 to 10, "1" being for the weakest items, until "10" for the most powerful ones. A barrel containing random treasure would contain a "rank 1" object, which would be rolled randomly between all the "rank 1" items. Later in the game, another barrel could contain a "rank 3" item which would be rolled between every "rank 3" items, etc.
This way you still keep the randomness, but it ensures that you won't get a powerful artifact in the first barrel you meet in the game.
This doesn't seem too hard to implement. In fact, I assume that BW has already implemented a mechanism like that (I played the demo and I haven't found powerful items in chests or barrels...)

[VPeric]

^Another (good) side of that system would be assurance you'll get something meaningful from a hard-to-access chest (Beating a Goblin Warlord should net you more than mandrake root and an empty flask).

[sirchet]

IMHO there will always be a way to to defeat randomly generated loot. I like the idea that the authors of this adventure left it up to me whether or not to cheat.

Cheats have their place, eg......5th or 6th play through.